Hey Everyone:
I wanted to ask this question and it is not exactly a tech question but more of a quality and price question. You probably know that my sons and I have Parkland Autosport. We have AN fittings, fire suppressions systems and several other exciting products coming on-line soon.
I would like to ask for your thoughts on two sources and their retail pricing.
We currently have an economy line of AN Fittings and hoses sourced out of Asia. The quality is good, the price is great and so on. I have the opportunity to add an American manufactured line with better quality but more expensive than the current line. The Asian fittings while priced low, there can be a real or "perceived" quality difference.
Here are two pricing examples:
Asian Source 6AN Straight Red/Blue $3.99 or Blk $4.99
US Sourced 6AN Straight Red/Blue $ 6.99 or Blk $7.99
Asian Sourced 6AN 90 Red/Blue $8.99 or Blk $9.99
US Sourced 6AM 90 Red/Blue $14.99 or Blk $15.99
I was searching the racing forums for discussions on fittings and I read a comment that made perfect sense to me. The guy said, "I am not putting a cheap foreign AN fitting on my $50,000 motor." I totally get the guy's point and caused me to evaluate the source/price/value model. You are the people that use and trust these products and we would really like your feedback. Don't worry I have thick skin so let me have it!
Can you give us your opinion:
What is the decision driver, pure price, product origin or American made?
Thank you in advance for your thoughts,
BR
You don't want me to fully go into why I don't buy Asian, it would bring a political tone to this forum, big time.
There are time now-a-days that it is not possible to buy around Asian products, however, there really has to be an overwhelming price and availability difference for me to buy Asian.
What you are talking about on pricing doesn't break the bank on price difference, and I would chose the domestic fittings for my use.
I vote USA.
Rouse
For no more than I buy or will buy I would pay for American High quality every time.
I buy imports only if there is no alternative .
Great feedback.
I agree and it is not my intent to bash any supplier or their origin. Thank you for being sensitive to that.
Thanks,
BR
I spent 40 years in the aeropspace hydraulics industry. I would not buy anything but American made. There are a lot of copy cat products
in the AeroSpace overhaul and repair depots that have been found over the years. On the Two Vesco streamliners we use Aeroquip on almost everything. BUY AMERICAN
All I have ever sold and still sell for AN fittings is domestic made stuff.
plus one on all replies.
franey
From Columbus, the Aeroquip dealer is a 100 mile round trip. When we need fittings I drive to Billings to the dealer and get all I need [and an extra]. I never ask the price. I need it, they don't fail me and I don't want a bag of 10 for the same price from Hong Kong next month. Just buy stuff that works.
Doug :cheers: :cheers: :cheers:
All of the fittings on the Treit and Davenport streamliner are American made.
FREUD
To tell the truth, I use JIC fittings. Stainless, And lots cheaper than Aeroquip. Same thing for all practical purposes. I never heard back, about my donation. But I hope I win the wrenches. Never had anything that colorful in my tool box.
Where are the "common", most readily available AN fittings made? I know I have a box full of leftover or unused fittings from previous projects (mostly jetboat stuff), but don't know the origin of many of the fittings.
Russell?
Aeroquip?
Edelbrock?
Earls?
I think it would be helpful if we knew where these brands were made. I will happily pay a few dollars more for a QUALITY American made fitting. That being said, Americans are just as capable as anyone else of making inferior products.
Which fittings are the good stuff?
Steve.
I am going to play devils advocate for a second. On a personal note that my family celebrates a 'no China Christmas' and I spend a great deal of time and effort to NOT buy anything made in China...(*except ironically China plates; this happened to come up recently....)
This being said.....
I have never seen an AN fitting from any manufacture fail under normal use, properly installed without aggravating circumstances.
My fittings fail because salt gets under the retainer nut/hose and rot from the inside out. Marlo has a very interesting AN fitting he shows around showing how an Aeroquip fitting melted away.
One could argue that a less expensive fitting would be a better investment as NO fitting within a similar price point will withstand salt termites. So if you are like me and replacing your fittings every couple of years cheaper fittings would make sense. I am slowly going to Earls SS fittings but they are about 4X more expensive then aluminum.
....I also hate saying it but....
I have looked at the 'Red Horse' brand of overseas made fittings and IMO are a very quality fitting. I dont use them and 99% of what I have is Earls but the Red Horse is a really good value for the money....no doubt.
http://www.rhp-usa.com/
~JH
This place where we live never recovered from the depression. Our industry is gone and the Chinese import raw logs and not finished lumber. Not much money for us there. We try to buy American or Canadian to keep as much industry here as we can. It is survival for us. Of course, I buy some British and Aussie stuff, too. I would not buy the Chinese fittings.
G'day from Oz. Australia also suffers from the "China" disease. I recall saying to a mate about 20 years ago, that if Oz ever goes to war (without you guys to back us up) that we would have to say to the enemy "Please sir, can you sell us some guns and ammo before we start- we can't manufacture them any more." It is even worse now. Ford recently announced it was closing its manufacturing plant in Geelong, here in Oz, in a couple of years. We are grossly overgoverned here with
politicians- if the idiots would simply mandate that all "Government" vehicles purchased, must be manufactured in Australia
it would be enough to keep that plant financially viable, but I guess that is too simple. Myself (and my few mates) are happy to pay a reasonable premium if the item is #1 Good quality and #2 Made in in Oz or USA. Hope I haven't breached any forum "politics" rules- I'll get off my hobby horse now and go back to the shed- I want to get that vette to Lake Gairdner next year.
Denis
Great feedback.
Australia has an awesome AN fitting company...all of their fittings are destined to flow and they are every bit the quality of our premium brands. The fittings have a unique trick look to them. Can't think of the name but I met them as the PRI show.
I don't want to use names of retailers because they would be more than happy to squash me. All of the big catalogs sell the aero quip, Russell or Earls, then they have a house brand. My Asian supplier build fittings for two of the big catalog companies. Some are private brand labeled and others are the exact same fittings that I can order.
True about the salt, a lot of electrolysis action too with the S/S hose and the static electricity from the fluids running through.
My new line will be price positioned above the Asian ANs but below the premium American made fittings. We will have the superman red/blue, black, polished, nickel and 3AN steal. S/S hose and black nylon covered hoses, filters, Y's and bungs. The best part about a domestic supplier is I can drop ship those rare oddball fittings that we sometimes need and help someone. With the Asian supplier to air ship a DHL envelope is $60.00. Making it impractical to get the odd or special order stuff in a timely and cost effective manner.
Thank you all for the great input.
BR
I have never seen a problem with "cheaper" AN fittings but have seen a problem with "cheaper" braided stainless hose. The rubber disintergrated from race gas.
Quote from: wheelrdealer on June 13, 2013, 04:18:48 AM
Great feedback.
Australia has an awesome AN fitting company...all of their fittings are destined to flow and they are every bit the quality of our premium brands. The fittings have a unique trick look to them. Can't think of the name but I met them as the PRI show.
BR
Seeing as you brought it up...... http://www.speedflow.com.au/index.html https://www.facebook.com/speedflowuk?fref=ts
I met one of the owners of this little Aussie battler company recently, like you I would buy patriotically! :cheers:
Graham
I buy the AN fittings I use on EBay. Mostly from Jegs. I had no idea there was Chinese knock offs.untill I read this thread. Silly me.
But my question is what size wrenches do you use? I purchased two sets of aluminum AN wrenches. Then I used a file and made sizes I need. I guess the good ones are proper size and the knock off is something not metric and not SAE. I don't know.
For five bucks you can have a chance at getting a good set of wrenches. See the "contest" notice at the top of the Forum page. Send your $$ via Paypal.
For double open end wrenches -04, -06, -08, -10, -12, -16 there are typically a socket and a nut wrench for each. Usually -03 and -20 you use a crescent for the socket.
If your ANs need a size adjustment they are probably built to low tolerances. If the spread easy then they are probably not 6061 T-6 but rather a lower grade aluminum. Without knowing what you purchased it is hard to tell about the wrench size. I think the AN -3 to -20 are the same hose size and the AN nut/sockets are the same AN size just the nut is threaded in mm versus SAE.
One way to compromise is to use the name brand fittings on critical fluids like dry sumps and fuel lines and the lower end fittings on vent lines, over flows and such. Just a thought.
BR
Quote from: RacerX9623 on June 13, 2013, 09:39:12 AM
I buy the AN fittings I use on EBay. Mostly from Jegs. I had no idea there was Chinese knock offs.untill I read this thread. Silly me.
But my question is what size wrenches do you use? I purchased two sets of aluminum AN wrenches. Then I used a file and made sizes I need. I guess the good ones are proper size and the knock off is something not metric and not SAE. I don't know.
Bill, I'll get a final tally of the number of entries tomorrow at the end of the day and send it to you either late night or Saturday morning. I'll give you details -- including, of course, the total number of entries so you can input that to your random number thingie.
Thanks again for the idea. It's worked well. Well enough, in fact, that someone else is proposing a similar "contest". I plan to give it a rest for a little while, though -- so the builders can get to building and the racers to (bench) racing. After all - it's less than two months 'til SpeedWeek.
Jon,
That is good news.
You are correct, Speedweek is all that matters now. Gotta save some money to afford a private Honey Bucket!
Send me a PM on how and when you want to announce the winner. That is, if the NSA does not leak the winner's name first! :-D
Good luck to all and it still not too late.
BR
Quote from: Seldom Seen Slim on June 13, 2013, 01:02:38 PM
Bill, I'll get a final tally of the number of entries tomorrow at the end of the day and send it to you either late night or Saturday morning. I'll give you details -- including, of course, the total number of entries so you can input that to your random number thingie.
Thanks again for the idea. It's worked well. Well enough, in fact, that someone else is proposing a similar "contest". I plan to give it a rest for a little while, though -- so the builders can get to building and the racers to (bench) racing. After all - it's less than two months 'til SpeedWeek.
Jon, it picked up a lot faster once on the cover page, next one should have bold and colorful letters so it gets the attention of the readers. Glead this is working out. It's a good deal for all and it supports the landracing budget. Thanks Wheeler Dealer.
Interesting observation, Glen. I got it on the Forum's home page by asking Bob to put it there, and he offered to do that bit gratis -- his contribution. Thanks for letting me know that you feel it was a wise move.
That's it for me tonight -- Nancy just headed for the ablutionarium and I will be right behind her. G'night, all.
I have always had good luck with Aeroquip and that is what I use whenever possible. XRP is awesome but $$$$, also not sure but I believe they are US made.
There are too many imports to list really but I have used Red Horse and they are pretty nice and cheap and don't seem to suffer from some of the issues that others do.
IF I could plumb everything with aeroquip pusklock, I would.
Bill the other thing is, some people like myself don't care for a certain style of fitting. For me, I don't like cutter style fittings. I see that your supplier has both????? Another reason I like Aeroquip and especially not Earls.
I use Aeroquip and BMRS, and like good tools they wont let you down when you least expect it. Tony
Bob
your avatar never lets me down either! :cheers:
Quote from: maguromic on June 13, 2013, 10:44:51 PM
I use Aeroquip and BMRS, and like good tools they wont let you down when you least expect it. Tony
I think I've used every brand there is. I have no favorite just wish they were closer color matched between brands. It's hard too worry about brands when you buy 4 milk crates full of fittings (some new) for $250 at a swap meet. I agree about hoses, really look at fuel lines closely every year and never leave anything in them. Fuel tank too..........JD
I was shopping for a new fuel filter today and noticed the 'Red Horse' looked very similar to the Russell filter. Thinking that Red Horse must be a cheaper knock off I did a side by side.
Well...
It wasnt a knock off; they had they same tooling marks. They were 100% identical in every way....and the same with the Edelbrock.
Turns out Red Horse makes their fittings along with HD, Jack Roush and others.
(http://www.streettunedmotorsports.com/parts/b/russell_fuel_filter_650133.jpg)
(http://img15.imageshack.us/img15/1374/edl8130w.jpg)
(http://www.surplusdepot.org/photos/4151062.fitting.jpg)
I ended up buying the 5$ cheaper Red Horse as apposed to the same filter with a different name on it.
~JH