Ok, So It's Stupid-Now Tell Me WHY It Won't Work!

[Glen]

It also crashed in the pit area at Lions and hit a trailer before stopping. I was about 20 feet away when it launched. Scared everyone around it.

[McRat]

Just thinnin'...  If the ratio by weight of gasoline to air is 12.5 for racing, for every gallon of gasoline you consume, that's 75lb of air per gallon.  Boost doesn't come into play.

Now just find out how many gallons you run a pass, and how many pounds of air a bottle holds.

In any case, nitrous is way more effective.

I was thinking of injecting argon into the engine to retard piston erosion.  At high boost levels, I'm eroding and igniting the aluminum pistons.  Argon is supposed to resist aluminum ignition.  Still have the argon bottle and solenoid, I just stopped racing when I was going to start the experiment.

[DallasV]

If the idea is to run in the gas class you might as well run nitrous anyway. If you have a compressed air tank, running to the intake, wheather it is air or not your going to have to run in the fuel class. No means to certify air.

[Seldom Seen Slim]

Dallas, you mean that Dan doesn't walk up to the car, open the valve, and take a big hit of the gas that's in there?  I mean, if it's air it's okay, and if it's nitrous -- well, man, yeah, I see it too. . .

[DallasV]

Dallas, you mean that Dan doesn't walk up to the car, open the valve, and take a big hit of the gas that's in there?  I mean, if it's air it's okay, and if it's nitrous -- well, man, yeah, I see it too. . .

I'm not saying that at all. I'm just saying he is not certifing anything. 

[McRat]

...  open the valve, and take a big hit of the gas that's in there?  I mean, if it's air it's okay, and if it's nitrous -- well, man, yeah, I see it too. . .

Perhaps get Demi Moore to do the testing?  Heard she's an expert...

Seriously, no big news here, but race nitrous is adulterated with something nasty to keep you from sniffing it.  Didn't USED to be, and I plead the fifth.

[ONEBADBUG]

I hope that someone with a more direct knowledge of this project chimes in here as these are memories from probably 30 years ago and can be somewhat hazy. I just don't think that SCTA would let you carry compressed gas bottles that weigh 1-200 lbs strapped into your car. What a potential bomb. Ever seen one with the head knocked off?!!! Awesome and dangerous!

Rex

This is what I was referring to with rules. One thing missed in the calcs so far, I think, is the engine could be sucking in air at the normal rate, and the amount needed is only above and beyond the naturally aspirated requirement. Also, as mentioned, you might as well be shoving in nitrous or some other thing that isn't 80% not combustable. (air)

[38flattie]

I hope that someone with a more direct knowledge of this project chimes in here as these are memories from probably 30 years ago and can be somewhat hazy. I just don't think that SCTA would let you carry compressed gas bottles that weigh 1-200 lbs strapped into your car. What a potential bomb. Ever seen one with the head knocked off?!!! Awesome and dangerous!

Rex

This is what I was referring to with rules. One thing missed in the calcs so far, I think, is the engine could be sucking in air at the normal rate, and the amount needed is only above and beyond the naturally aspirated requirement. Also, as mentioned, you might as well be shoving in nitrous or some other thing that isn't 80% not combustable. (air)

....except then we're talking about a 'fuel' powered engine. I'm simply trying to gain boost, by adding previously compressed air, instead of using a supercharger to compress it.

...Or, I could sniff the nitrous, and simply THINK I had accomplished it!

[kiwi belly tank]

 
  Sid.

[Jack Gifford]

Like most things, yes it's been tried before...

That looks like an actual "air powered" car, as I saw demonstrated at an NHRA Indy Nationals in about 1962. It didn't have an internal combustion engine, just an "air motor" (turbine?) that drove the wheels.

[38flattie]

If the idea is to run in the gas class you might as well run nitrous anyway. If you have a compressed air tank, running to the intake, wheather it is air or not your going to have to run in the fuel class. No means to certify air.

Dallas, I agree it would have to be a fuel class, if any class at all. Based on past 'rulings' it's doubtful that I'd be allowed to run in a class, as the compressed air for supercharging, I'm told, has been deemed a no-no.

Still, it would be worth it to run time only, just to see the HP gains possible, from not losing the parasitic losses.

As for the compressed bottles not being allowed, or not passing tech, precedent has already been set, when they allowed the French liner, and possibly others, to run. In addition to bottles, I think a specially constructed frame, certified and tested to 5000 PSI would be an air storage benefit.

[McRat]

Should be able to test gases easily and cheaply.

Take a container (large plastic clear tube preferred) and a fireplace match.

Open the valve into the container.

Stick match into the container. 

Match gets brighter, either oxidant or fuel is present.  If they use hydrogen, it will make a small pop, and get sent home.

No need to hire Demi Moore...

There are intercooler systems that are used that pump CO2 on the outside of the intercooler to get better charge cooling.  I wouldn't consider that cheating, any more than an ice bath intercooler.  But the lack of testing on compressed gases makes it no-no.

[John Burk]

An ice water inlet air cooler on a NA engine would be like bringing World Finals air to Speedweek . A 6% + HP gain . Has that been tried ?

[hotschue]

Ice water cooled intercooler, NA on gas....We have been using it on several cars since 2008.....hopefully can document performance this year.

[interested bystander]

I'm thinkin' that air cylinder powered car belonged to Dale Grantham who I think was affiliated with AiResearch in Phoenix and I'm sure I saw it make a 7 second run at Fontana. Pretty sure Glen's right about the crash at LIONS (same car).