El Mirage

[desotoman]

If you can set a record with gas in a fuel class more power to you.

Some would say the same about setting 3.0L records with 2.0L class engines...

I had originally posted that you could not run gas in the fuel class and ended up with egg on my face. Rules change and I apparently did not know. My mistake.

We need to go back to the 1986 rule book as far as the definition of fuel goes. Section II-2. Fuel: In fuel classes any approved liquid fuel may be used. Approved fuels are: Nitrous Oxide, Nitromethane, and Methanol.
Notice NO Gas of any type was allowed in the fuel class.

SCTA (we) need to be consistent in our rules. And as much as I hate to say it John is right. If you are allowed to run gas in the fuel class to set records, you should be allowed to jump up a class with smaller motors. It is no different.

In my opinion the gas powered vehicles have their own class, and should not be allowed to run in the fuel classes. No different than a guy who has a 2.0 Liter motor and wants to run in the 3.0 liter class.

Tom G.

[JackD]

Unapproved gas has been in the rulebook and in use for many, many years longer than that.
Gasohol would be an example of unapproved gas.
When SCTA realized their oversight about unapproved gas, they fixed it.
Phony engines are a much later deterioration.

[dwarner]

Tom,

Your wrong on this one. If I set up and dyno my 1200 hp SBC on V16 and don't want to change from my known base line I must run in the fuel class. If I don't use the vendor's gas at a salt event then I am forced to the fuel classes.

Jack D can remember the days when a gas provider was difficult to find. Think California Old gas. The concession to require the use of a vendor's gas was made to ensure the continued support of known constant.

What ever happened to the Lancaster based VP dealer who promised to support ALL events? He disappeared after two El Mirage meets.

DW

[JackD]

"California Gold" was arranged for by Don Vesco and it was the gas of the event.
It burned so slow and required so much liquid that it immediately cost
two broken, high dollar engines. Bill Brooks BBC was one and my Buick was at least one another.
We got some gas from the airport and ran in the fuel class to set a record
with the small car.
Then I backed it off to 125 mph and Wendy let various lady members drive and get a film tape of the whole deal.
I modified their sticker to read "CALIFORNIA MOLD "

"Be very careful when you cite histoory."

[Dynoroom]

Glad I think like Dan  

Tom, visit the fuel provider. He will tell you he can sell you a gasoline that will NOT pass the SCTA's DE test. Also if I enter my car in a fuel class why would the tech team even want to look in my tank? It has no seal, I'm running fuel class, I'm in impound, Oh ya if you look we've never set a record in the fuel class even though we could have, but someone else has.

[Dynoroom]

"California Gold" was arranged for by Don Vesco and it was the gas of the event.
It burned so slow and required so much liquid that it immediately cost
two broken, high dollar engines. Bill Brooks BBC was one and my Buick was at least one another.
We got some gas from the airport and ran in the fuel class to set a record
with the small car.
Then I backed it off to 125 mph and Wendy let various lady members drive and get a film tape of the whole deal.
I modified their sticker to read "CALIFORNIA MOLD "

"Be very careful when you cite histoory."

We set a record using the "gold" in car 42 @ 242, didn't you test with it? That's right we didn't either, so I softened the tune up because I didn't know what the fuel would do... that's my history.

[Harold Bettes]

Some consideration should be given for use of E85 as it will become more and more of an issue in the potential "greening" of automotive fuels.

The biodiesel movement is growing and the E85 thing can be a good thing for automotive racing.

As I understand the rules, E85 would fall under the current definition of fuel that is other than the gasoline supplied at a meet.

Regards to All,
HB2

[JackD]

As soft as I made the tuneup, my Buick driver could not feel it going away
as opposed to Wendy in a Ford that knew exactly what was going on and
backed off.
We used Hilborn and Holly, not Muchotech and Electrosmart.

[Dynoroom]

As soft as I made the tuneup, my Buick driver could not feel it going away
as opposed to Wendy in a Ford that knew exactly what was going on and
backed off.
We used Hilborn and Holly, not Muchotech and Electrosmart.

I understand how much "electricks" have helped us today, but in that day and age we too were running draw-thru holley carbs Jack. Maybe it was the Buick  

I know "my" history.

[JackD]

The same setup on ERC bumped a 178 record to over 200 the following year with no tune up changes.
Perhaps the Pushrodders and the 2 smokes should be protected from the OHC motors.

[jimmy six]

The year of California Gold I was running nitrous and brought 20 gallons of VP-14 to the salt along with 6 bottles of nitrous.

My son set a record in our 40 Chev in the basic 3 passes. (you do remember those days). I had 3 guys come up and ask how I didn't blow up because they thought I was using the "sh-t".

I had 15 gallons left and I was a very popular guy before I left and I didn't carry any home.

[JackD]

Because of the time schedule, I met Wolfington down at the airport and
bought 5 gal. of aviation gas (sorta fuel) at 5:30 in the AM.
I didn't even want too put the Mold in the truck or dump it so I gave it back.

[dwarner]

The reason I brought up California "Old" and Jack D is because my memory is not as good as his, or his stories.

I knew the record would be set straight when Jack checked in.

Harold, out of approx 480 entries at Speedweek only one used E85. Set three records in fuel classes. Doesn't seem to be a need to change.

DW

[hotrod]

I'm a strong proponent of E85, (run 3 cars on it). It is becoming a very popular performance fuel.

I think at least at the moment it belongs in the fuel class as it has more in common with the methanol fueled engines than it does the gasoline engines.

It is worth somewhere between 5%-8% power increase simply by changing fuel and tweak of the tune over the same engine on a comparable octane gasoline for NA engines. On turbocharged or blown engines it compares very favorably with methanol for performance while being less toxic and less corrosive.


One issue with E85, is unlike pump gas, there is not a well defined "standard" E85 blend, as the gasoline component is not well defined in the ASTM standard as I recall. Any blend from 70% to 85% ethanol can be properly identified as E85.

Larry

[JackD]

As the laws catchup with the fuel business, things will change.
I think we can trust ERC (Rick Gold) to do the best for us
as long as we do our best for him.
At sometime in the future it might mean changing our requirements and
it won't be a knee jerk reaction.
We have him to thank for many years of a good product and advice.
Ya just gotta know he loves the sport because he ain't making no money.

We all suffered a knee to the crotch here lately but we can fix it  too.