Bockscar 2.0

ggl205 · September 15, 2021, 05:26:43 AM

Oh shoot, Stainless, now I have to look for more 18X4.4 aircraft tires.

John

PorkPie · September 15, 2021, 06:41:42 AM

the right racer + full throttle.......

Quote from: Lemming Motors on September 15, 2021, 04:27:42 AM
Who knew an I-Bifil (I/BFL) could be so fast; holy crap that is awesome.

PorkPie · September 15, 2021, 07:11:42 AM

John, maybe you don't know that....

but 26 years ago JohnBoy set a record of 221 mph in I/FL.....to that time the original Bockscar still has the shape as he was designed.....

the 2.0 bases mostly on the original aerodynamic philosophie.....

221 with unblown....now 241 with blown engine....plus the advantage of the today technology to produce "power"...

so you can compare JohnBoys performance with the record from Ross

Quote from: PorkPie on September 15, 2021, 06:41:42 AM
the right racer + full throttle.......

Quote from: Lemming Motors on September 15, 2021, 04:27:42 AM
Who knew an I-Bifil (I/BFL) could be so fast; holy crap that is awesome.

Stainless1 · September 16, 2021, 08:36:21 AM

Rex, when I went 246 with the H motor, I was 242 at the 4 so he was probably on a faster run... yea amazed me too... I was thinking a record in the 30s was possible... of course they're always are fastest before they....

The data shows I was running out of injector... they are 650cc so I guess before I run fuel again we need to dyno with the 1000cc injectors. It was hard to get a good idle at 2000rpm, probably idle a little faster with the big ones.

I am looking at the options for WF... switching back to gas class for James to work on his record. I may add gear, we will see... it won't be a big change

We did take a trophy holding team pic

Lemming Motors · September 16, 2021, 09:37:01 AM

Please stop: there is a risk Bockscar will cause a red hat shortage.

PorkPie · September 16, 2021, 10:56:39 AM

...a couple years ago a long time competitor of the original Bockscar said to me:

"the Bockscar is our Nemesis..."

...well...I fear, the Nemesis is back in the shape of the 2.0....

as Stainless I'm also very surprised about the performance....

it was a lot better than I calculate.....maybe the salt was this year really good.....and the numbers I used was a little bit too pessimistic (after the salt I have seen up to 2017...no wonder)...

my calculation was for a run under good condition up to 240 mph....

seeing Ross return time slip.....well....it looks he was on the way to pick a AA license or very close to....

...after this performance I only can say.....the package works.....

.....and therefore....I have a very wide smile in the face......so d a m n happy....... :clap :clap

sabat · September 16, 2021, 01:46:16 PM

MORE congratulations! We're running out of things to say to you guys! WTFG.

On duty cycle - do you have any headroom in base fuel pressure? I know crazy people that cranked 'em to 100psi on the dragstrip

Best of luck at WF, how many hats in one season is the record I wonder?

Dean

Rex Schimmer · September 16, 2021, 02:13:29 PM

Bob,
What is the lambda number for E85? I know that it is 6.8 for methanol and 13.7 for gas. Are you using the same turbo for the E85 as you used for gasoline? What fuel pressure do you run? Upping the fuel pressure can help but you need a really good fuel pump as increased pressure really increases internal leakage which reduces the expected pump output. I know you know this, but the flow through an orfice (injector nozzle) is a function of the square root of the new pressure divided by the previous pressure so if you double the pressure the actual flow increase is the square root of 2 (1.414). Do you monitor the fuel pressure during a run?

Lots of question and as usual you can tell me to "pound sand" if you want but it is always great to learn new things.

Rex

floydjer · September 16, 2021, 02:20:58 PM

Happy looking group.

Stainless1 · September 16, 2021, 08:58:37 PM

Rex, I planned and tuned for a .8 Lambda... it was .84 and occasionally .86 on the last run. The injectors were running 98% duty... way too high... basically just spraying all they could. The fuel pump was dyno'd at 45 base pressure and it rises slightly over 1:1 with boost.
I really don't want to turn up FP because electricity is always a premium and the higher the pressure the more amps the pump requires...
Using the same stuff we had for Gas... just a different tune.
We will be good at WF because I'm going back to Gas so James can run against his own record.
The car body panels are off and cleaned, have a few spots on the frame to tend to before I start going through the motor checks... plenty to do in the next 2 weeks.

PorkPie · September 17, 2021, 02:33:05 AM

unfortunately we are running out of new drivers without a red hat.....

....call that a luxury problem.......

Quote from: sabat on September 16, 2021, 01:46:16 PM
Best of luck at WF, how many hats in one season is the record I wonder?

Dean

SPARKY · September 17, 2021, 04:37:06 AM

WOW what a year congrats guys

Milwaukee Midget · September 17, 2021, 05:48:48 AM

Quote from: PorkPie on September 17, 2021, 02:33:05 AM
unfortunately we are running out of new drivers without a red hat..... ....call that a luxury problem.......

Punch it out, turn up the wick and go for blue.

Problem solved.

Rex Schimmer · September 17, 2021, 01:10:38 PM

Bob,
If you go back in the build diary for the Carbinite streamliner they talk about going from gasoline to methanol and they started with the turbo that they ran with gas and were seeing around 100 psi of exhaust back pressure when they ran methanol. This was due to the huge increase of exhaust gas volume that the methanol made because it runs about two times as rich as gasoline. They went to new turbos that had the same compressor size but a much larger turbine side, this eliminated the exhaust back pressure and also provided several hundred additional hps! You may be seeing some of the same on your engine especially if you look at the failure of your header. Might be something to look at they next time you have it bolted to the dyno. (Not that you need more hp ) Ha, Ha.

Rex

Stainless1 · September 17, 2021, 03:48:09 PM

Chris, we actually have a goal... get someone a AA... it started in 2011 when I went 246... and then destroyed the motor on the return run, still netting a record but.... that run started me working toward 2.0.... I picked up steel, and started putting things on a mental list of things we had to learn and fix.
The unblown 1 liter that Pork Pie ran was part of that learning curve... that was the first MoTec ECU, all before that were done with stock ECUs and piggy back helpers... the fast turbo motor that self destructed had multiple piggybacks.... also known as points of failure....
So I learned MoTec while we were racing Pork Pie's 2 records in 2012...
The next step was turbo with MoTec... We had that little glitch with the big car and my program fell a little behind schedule.... but I did get a 1 liter turbo motor built... that motor is part of the turbo learning curve...
We are smack dab in the middle of that portion right now... of course in the mean time we built 2.0, raced it last year with the old M4 MoTec, now it has the new MoTec and I am learning more since the M84 is Windows and not DOS based. Of course there is no convert program so a lot of hand work... Now I am looking at the capabilities from the new and implementing those as we go.
As always the quest continues...

Rex, I am shopping for a new turbo... I am running in a bad efficiency zone and this one is about maxed out. I think I need a bigger turbine side that flows better...
That's on the list

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Bockscar 2.0