Help with classification

[notfarnow]

I'm back!

I got my Bonneville rule book (thanks Sparky!), and have been reading up on classes and rules.

Here is a "hypothetical" car I'd like help classifying:

Starting point:
A lengthened Formula Vee Or Formula First chassis.
Something like this:


-Add a proper roll cage
-Lengthen to accept a VW 1.6 turbo diesel engine

Questions:
-Could that run in Lakester G/BGL?
-If I understand correctly, assuming that I could run Lakester G/BGL, I'd have to use tires rated to match the current record (189.205)

Now, here's the big hitch: If I wanted to run vegetable oil or biodiesel, does that mean I'd have to run "for time only", because I'd have to use approved fuel to run that class?

1.B Classification:
"Any vehicle, which is not legal for any class, but meets technical regulations

Thoughts?

[Sumner]

As long as non of the body work is further out than the inner plane of the tires (on the narrowest axle) you could run as a lakester as far as I know.

I would think your fuel would put you into the fuel class where the record is I believe 204.

I feel that both the BG and BF records are pretty soft so by the time you get the car done, unless it is this year, you take the chance of the records maybe being quite a bit higher.  I would get all the safety equipment for 200+ including tires.

c ya and good luck,

Sum

[notfarnow]

Thanks Sumner!

I've spend A LOT of time on your site, by the way. Very good reading, and lots of great ideas. I love the idea of mocking things up in wood!

I would think your fuel would put you into the fuel class where the record is I believe 204.

OK, page 16 2.B:
"In fuel classes, any approved liquid fuel may be used[/u]. Examples of approved fuels are: alcohol, hydrogen, nitro methane blends, nitrous oxide, and unapproved gasoline."

So, how do I find out if vegetable oil is considered "approved"? If it's not "approved", does that mean I run for time only?

I feel that both the BG and BF records are pretty soft so by the time you get the car done, unless it is this year, you take the chance of the records maybe being quite a bit higher.  I would get all the safety equipment for 200+ including tires.

Great advice, thanks!

[tortoise]

If diesel oil is declared an "approved" fuel, you would be at a big disadvantage to the nitromethane fueled cars you'd be running against. If you want to contend for a record with a diesel, put it in a mini-pickup. Unfortunately, with a 1.6 liter motor, you're just over the class H limit, near the bottom of class G. Maybe you could sleeve or destroke it.

[JackD]

Compression Ignition should be it's own engine type and not lumped with the SPARKERS.

[notfarnow]

If diesel oil is declared an "approved" fuel, you would be at a big disadvantage to the nitromethane fueled cars you'd be running against. If you want to contend for a record with a diesel, put it in a mini-pickup. Unfortunately, with a 1.6 liter motor, you're just over the class H limit, near the bottom of class G. Maybe you could sleeve or destroke it.

Actually, I could just as easily run a 1.9 turbo diesel, so maybe that would make more sense. Not as many of them in the boneyards though. As for running a modified pickup, well... I don't want a pickup. I'd rather run a car I liked in a bad class, than run a competitive class in a car I didn't like. Plus, by running vegetable oil, I'd have to run "time only".

With a modified formula vee, I could at least use it locally at some local road racing venues. Heck, a few people have even snuck them past the DMV for road use. Great fun!

Compression Ignition should be it's own engine type and not lumped with the SPARKERS.

Agreed. Once the North American market starts getting flooded with Honda & Toyota diesels, we'll probably see more interest in racing them.

[sockjohn]

If diesel oil is declared an "approved" fuel, you would be at a big disadvantage to the nitromethane fueled cars you'd be running against. If you want to contend for a record with a diesel, put it in a mini-pickup. Unfortunately, with a 1.6 liter motor, you're just over the class H limit, near the bottom of class G. Maybe you could sleeve or destroke it.

I thought the VW Polo had a 1.3L turbo in Europe, but this may be a really hard engine to find in North America.  I don't think the Polo would pass US crash tests. 

[notfarnow]

There is the early VW 1.5 liter diesel too. I'll have to check and see what the exact displacement is, it may fall below the 1.51 for "G". Perhaps I could run one of those in "H".

[tortoise]

well... I don't want a pickup. I'd rather run a car I liked in a bad class, than run a competitive class in a car I didn't like.

I can understand that.

By the way, the FIA record for specially constructed automobiles, supercharged diesel, 1500cc (category A, group III, class 7) is rather soft at 129.908 mph for the flying kilometer.

[notfarnow]

well... I don't want a pickup. I'd rather run a car I liked in a bad class, than run a competitive class in a car I didn't like.

I can understand that.

By the way, the FIA record for specially constructed automobiles, supercharged diesel, 1500cc (category A, group III, class 7) is rather soft at 129.908 mph for the flying kilometer.

Oh now we're talking!
I'll have to learn how to read those FIA records, there seems to be 2-3 listed for some classes:

[Sumner]

well... I don't want a pickup. I'd rather run a car I liked in a bad class, than run a competitive class in a car I didn't like.

I can understand that.

By the way, the FIA record for specially constructed automobiles, supercharged diesel, 1500cc (category A, group III, class 7) is rather soft at 129.908 mph for the flying kilometer.

Oh now we're talking!
I'll have to learn how to read those FIA records, there seems to be 2-3 listed for some classes:

One small/large problem might be where/when are you going to be able to run on an FIA record,

Sum

[notfarnow]

Looks like many of those FIA records are set at Bonneville, but I suspect they stage them at different times. First time I've really taken note of FIA records, I'll have to look into it some more. Their website is horrible.

[tortoise]

I'll have to learn how to read those FIA records, there seems to be 2-3 listed for some classes:

Yeah, I just went to the site for the first time out of curiosity raised by your post. The multiple records are in chronological order, with the latest always the fastest, as far as I can see.

Sum is right about going fast enough not necessarily being the biggest part of setting an FIA record.

[JackD]

The FIA has the feature of listing the previous record information also.

[LittleLiner]

Why don't you run it as a streamliner?  All you need to do is enclose two wheels.  The Diesel Streamliner records for G and H are 145 and 116.