motorcycle "vintage" class model year restrictions?

[willieworld]

2008 and 7/12     willie buchta

[Ratliff]

In 1973, there was total of twelve SCTA classes for open bikes. All based solely on engine displacement and fuel type. Six fuel classes. Six gas classes. Frame type or frame modifications were irrelevant because there was no such thing as a production class. To set a record you had to be the fastest for your displacement class on gas or the fastest for your displacement class on fuel. Period.

That was then.  Time to hit the fast forward button on your life.  In case you're wondering its 2008.

Yes, and motorcycle records are now based on changing the color of your duct tape instead of actually achieving the fastest speed per cubic inch for a given displacement class.

At Speedweek 2008 there were 61 car records of over 175 mph set, or 56%, for an average record speed of 191.8 mph.

By coincidence, the average speed of the 107 car records listed in the 1974 SCTA rulebook is also 191.8 mph.

So how has it happened that 35 years of technical progress has had no influence whatsoever on the average speed of SCTA car records?

[willieworld]

i think its the harleys that screw up the average --the motor i run a 2003 has about the same technological advances as the 1936 that its patterend after--explain to me if you would all of those technological advances that make my vehicle go faster----------------willie buchta

[reckon]

Yes, and motorcycle records are now based on changing the color of your duct tape instead of actually achieving the fastest speed per cubic inch for a given displacement class.

At Speedweek 2008 there were 61 car records of over 175 mph set, or 56%, for an average record speed of 191.8 mph.

By coincidence, the average speed of the 107 car records listed in the 1974 SCTA rulebook is also 191.8 mph.

So how has it happened that 35 years of technical progress has had no influence whatsoever on the average speed of SCTA car records?

this may be,...........

all I know it's takes some balls to sit on a tiny motorcycle and try and go really fast, ANY motorcycle,...

I for one welcome the multitude of classes/motor/aspiration/fuel options available these days I think it gives guys like me a chance at actually setting an LSR.

[willieworld]

ive read the rules 3 times and cant find the duct tape color change you mention --maybe if you gave me a page number i could find it   thanks  willie buchta

[Nortonist 592]

Ratliff,  I'm thinking about passing the hat around and seeing if I can get enough to buy you a rulebook.  Preferably a 2009 rulebook (when they are printed).  If you examine it you will see that all motorcycle classes are based on displacement.  From 50cc to unlimited.  A class record is determined by who goes fastest for a given displacement.  But that seems to be unable to penetrate that Rockwell 85 skull of yours.  If you are going to write stupid statements like your first sentence it would be my bet that you wouldn't know one end of a bike from the other if shown one.

[willieworld]

put me in for 1 dollar-----no actually i have an extra 08 if franklin will send me his address i will be glad to send it to him   ------------------willie buchta

i have a pair of leathers that will fit you also

[reckon]

Ratliff,  I'm thinking about passing the hat around and seeing if I can get enough to buy you a rulebook.  Preferably a 2009 rulebook (when they are printed).  If you examine it you will see that all motorcycle classes are based on displacement.  From 50cc to unlimited.  A class record is determined by who goes fastest for a given displacement.  But that seems to be unable to penetrate that Rockwell 85 skull of yours.  If you are going to write stupid statements like your first sentence it would be my bet that you wouldn't know one end of a bike from the other if shown one.

not to mention ratliff's RIDICULOUS thread hijack (this ain't my first forum ya know), so I'll also add, that this is MY THREAD, asking a legitimate question and you should bring that crap up IN YOUR OWN THREAD.

manners are still manners, even with a computer and keyboard in front of you. (nice welcome to these boards too )

oh and P.S.:
apparently the SCTA needs to learn the difference between "vintage" and "antique" 

K,...........nuff sed

[Nortonist 592]

Your right Reckon.   Apologies for the hijack.  But you know,  the SCTA got the vintage thing right.  50 years old is a nice figure for vintage.  I know lots of racing associations use 25 years old as a "vintage" figure.  But to a lot of people 25 years old is "used" rather than vintage.  And the SCTA doesn't have a used class.  My Norton is 48 years old and the engine is 33 years old.  It runs in the 500cc pushrod class.  Apart from Buell and the Honda CX 500 when was the last time any manufacturer offerred a 500 pushrod motor for sale?  Don't let an age definition stop you.  Its a great sport with great (most of them) people.  Com'on out and join us.  You might just geet bitten.

[Ratliff]

i think its the harleys that screw up the average --the motor i run a 2003 has about the same technological advances as the 1936 that its patterend after--explain to me if you would all of those technological advances that make my vehicle go faster----------------willie buchta

Freakin' Harleys. Always throwing that monkey into the wrench.

[Ratliff]

Ratliff,  I'm thinking about passing the hat around and seeing if I can get enough to buy you a rulebook.  Preferably a 2009 rulebook (when they are printed).  If you examine it you will see that all motorcycle classes are based on displacement.  From 50cc to unlimited.  A class record is determined by who goes fastest for a given displacement.  But that seems to be unable to penetrate that Rockwell 85 skull of yours.  If you are going to write stupid statements like your first sentence it would be my bet that you wouldn't know one end of a bike from the other if shown one.

Frame type, origin of the frame, modifications made to the frame, etc were irrelevant in 1973. When you set a record it WASN'T this much speed on this displacement with this type frame. You had to be the fastest period on fuel or the fastest period on gas in your displacement class to set a record.

[Nortonist 592]

Aah yes,  You are thinking of the F.I.M.   No restrictions just displacement.  You need to leave this forum and go to the FIM forum and check out how popular LSR is there.  In the meantime leave those of us who are happy with the SCTA giving us classes that we can race in and be competitive (and that is the key word) alone.  If your theory was applied to the SCTA there would be only streamlned classes because nothing wlse would be competitive.  Why not apply that thinking to the car world.  You got a 500 inch roadster?  Yes sir.  Well you're in the same class as that 500 inch streamliner over there.  If that was the case you'd soon have nothing to whine about because LSR would disappear bar the occassional outing.  Get a life and start talking out of the right orifice.

[panic]

"If you examine it you will see that all motorcycle classes are based on displacement.  From 50cc to unlimited.  A class record is determined by who goes fastest for a given displacement."

Please let me know when this is scheduled to start?

[reckon]

Your right Reckon.   Apologies for the hijack.  But you know,  the SCTA got the vintage thing right.  50 years old is a nice figure for vintage.  I know lots of racing associations use 25 years old as a "vintage" figure.  But to a lot of people 25 years old is "used" rather than vintage.  And the SCTA doesn't have a used class.  My Norton is 48 years old and the engine is 33 years old.  It runs in the 500cc pushrod class.  Apart from Buell and the Honda CX 500 when was the last time any manufacturer offerred a 500 pushrod motor for sale?  Don't let an age definition stop you.  Its a great sport with great (most of them) people.  Com'on out and join us.  You might just geet bitten.

thanks, and don't worry, I'm already "bitten"

speaking of nortons, I have restored more nortons than I can count (my two best customers were brit bike shops) including a 62 dominator, and a genuine manx (pic whoring now to commence)




ok back to the thread,

I'm going to concentrate on the little bikes (since I'm already little) and there seems to be alot of open categories, and fairly low MPH records in the under 250cc classes.

ultimately I'd like to see if I can get a 125cc bike over 200mph (streamliner), which may in fact be impossible, but I'll have a great time trying to find that out, and as you (and I) already mentioned, probably make some lifelong friends along the way.

I now work as a plastics fabricator, and have lots of experience working with carbon fiber/kevlar/fiberglass layups (fairings), as well as polycarbonate windscreens, and making small parts from exotic plastics like "ULTEM"(high heat acrylic), and hard to fabricate plastics like PET and polypro (oil/water tanks)  so I'm SURE someone out there will have a need for something I do, and I'm also SURE that they will do/have something I need, and I just LOVE work/skill trades when trying to get someplace impossible like 200mph on a chickadee sized bike. (thank you willie, I'll call you)

one more question, if I may (since you were reading this far anyway )

whats the difference, rulebook wise, between an APS and an MPS?

[Nortonist 592]

The differences between APS and MPS is something that you would really want to read the rule book.  But A gives you more modification freedom than M.   Also a machine like a Triton will run A because M must have the frame and engine from the same manufacturer.  I run A for that reason.  I have a bone stock Norton frame with a Weslake speedway engine in it so I'm in A.  Doesn't matter.  I just want to race.  Nothing is impossible.  Look at Buddenbaum's 140 mph 50cc streamliner.  And you can never post too many Norton photos.  Just go easy on Jubilee photos LOL.