Photography Question

[Jimbob]

Quick Q for all the photographers, what lenses are you using for best results when shooting the cars on the sat??

Cheers
JC

[hotrod]

When you are in the spectator area along side the main course, you are about 1000' feet from the cars at closest approach. At slightly oblique angles as the cars approach you, the optical distance is as much as 1/2 mile. Anything less that a 200 mm (35 millimeter full frame equivalent) is pretty much useless for cars on the course. You have to get up over 300mm to 400mm focal length to get near full frame shots.

The streamliners (long ones) will completely fill the frame at about 400 mm at closest approach. The bikes and small cars need 500mm to get descent image size. If you have a high pixel count camera you can get away with a bit shorter lens if you are willing to crop down the image to get the view you want, but you lose a lot of resolution. Lighting is back lighting most of the day so the dark cars lose a lot of image quality in the shadow if you are cropping too much.

Lens needs a good lens hood (on the long course you will be shooting into the sun for 2/3 of the day). Because of the altitude and glare a warm UV filter or polarized filter help cut the blue cast you get from excess UV. The polarizer will cost you enough light though, that most cameras will have to use higher iso settings than you would like (makes for image noise) in the morning hours.

You will need a fast shutter speed on these long lenses ( I prefer 2x the focal length or more if I can) ie a 400 mm lens you will want to shoot at faster than 1/800 second to cut down blurring from both motion and heat mirage unless your panning technique is flawless.

Some of the photographers shoot at shutter speeds as low as 1/50 second to get blurring of the wheels on the bikes but you have to be very good at panning and you lose a lot of shots due to unintentional camera motion at those slow shutter speeds.

If you are shooting in and around the pits and staging areas you will want lenses ranging from mild wide angle to 200 mm to cover most of the shots. You will use mild wide angle to about 50mm equivalent for most stationary shots.

Larry

[PorkPie]

HotRod,

just a question to your note.....all the lens length work to 1,6 crop factor.....normal standard digital camera body

or to full size typ.

for a full size chip a 400 can be too short for a streamliner....

see ya

Pork Pie

[Seldom Seen Slim]

Untechnical response -- I'm not in the Pork Pie and Larry league -- by a very long shot.  Now that I've said that -- remember that the vehicles on the long course are at high speed when they go past you (assuming, of course, that you want to catch them at speed).  Because they're moving so fast you'll have a very short "window" of time in which to complete the exposure -- it'll be difficult to get the vehicle nicely centered in the frame.  The longer the lens, the more difficult it'll be.  But then, remember, the shorter lenses will allow you more time to get the race vehicle, even if it isn't perfectly centered.  The short lenses, of course, will make you forfeit some of the ability to make enlargements -- too few exposed pixels of the race vehicle.  It's a trade-off.  Up to me?  Start with a medium-short lens, at least get the vehicle as it roars past, and then - as your skills advance - go longer and longer.  Don't try to take high-end pro photos the first day out there - maybe not even the first event.  Get some good shots, enjoy them, then decide what to do next to better them the next time you're out there.

That -- and take a handful of data chips.  Make sure that you've got five or six, not just the two that many people carry.  Digital "film" is cheap and reusable.  Remember to mark each chip with a Sharpie or something to keep them a little more in order when you go looking for certain shots you've taken.

[PorkPie]

SSS,

be aware that a normal standard camera body also got only a standard auto focus system.....

if you use a shorter lens to get the racer into the center or somewhere close to the middle of the picture you maybe end up with a racer who is not sharp, the reason...the auto focus system will not recognize the racer and will focus into the nowhere....

you be right with the problem to get a fast racer like the Speed Demon into the center or close to....

but here helps a trick....pick the racer far before he is close to your place.....follow the racer with a movement out of your hip..... .... start to make picture when the racer is in a 30 degrees angle in the viewfinder....not when he is right in front of you....too late....don't interrupt your moving....if you do this....the racer is out of your viewfinder.....and than it is though to pick him again....stop to make picture when you can see the parachute tubes properly....some of the picture will be right for prints.

what I explained need some practice and at the beginning the result of useable picture will be a smaller percentage....but this is the way to get one day the right shot....

[Peter Jack]

Pork Pie, you're showing your Canon bias. We Nikonians use a factor of 1.5. 

I do a lot of bird photography with an 80 - 400 zoom lens. It gives you a little more flexibility and birds are great to practice panning as they don't even necessarily follow the expected path. I normally carry two bodies, one with a macro or a shorter zoom, the latter which would be handy in the pits and line ups. The second body just makes it nice in that you seldom have to change lenses and You're ready almost instantly for any shot.

I have nothing to do with the outfit but the best money I've spent on photography equipment in quite some time is the Cotton Carrier. It makes long lenses easy to carry, is very quick and easy to use, and leaves both hands free when you need them. I rarely go out shooting without it now.

Pete

[Seldom Seen Slim]

Thanks, PP, for the reminder about auto-focus.  Often I'll override it (and forgot to mention such) so I can preset focus.  Maybe I'll focus on one vehicle going past before the bike or car I want -- just to have a chance to get the focus correct.

As for moving with the vehicle -- thank you for the very good tips.  Moving the hips, hunh?  And shoot when the vehicle isn't directly in front of you.  Sure enough, the exposure will be of the hind end of the car if you wait for it to be in the middle of the viewfinder.

Thanks to all that are offering help here.  It oughta allow all of us to do a better job of taking pictures on the Salt - and wherever we go.

[Buickguy3]

  You guys are all assuming that we all shoot digital or 35 MM format. Medium format is a whole different game. Oh, damn, I forgot, nobody sells or processes film any more. Anybody need any obsolete Haselblads?
     Doug 

[Captthundarr]

  You guys are all assuming that we all shoot digital or 35 MM format. Medium format is a whole different game. Oh, Dodge, I forgot, nobody sells or processes film any more. Anybody need any obsolete Haselblads?
     Doug 

How much?

[PorkPie]

Pete,

you be right with the 1,5 factor for Nikon.....I used the 1,6 factor from Canon....the most fun photographer with a proper equipment are still using Canon....ok, today you can get a proper Nikon camera body for a fair prize....but there is still the problem with the prize range for a proper Nikon lens....

To my own equipment....for the long distance I'm using a Canon 1D Mark IV with a 1,3 factor....at the startingline a 5D Mark II with fullsize.....the 1DS prize is out of earth.

SSS,

about moving out of the hip....maybe I had better written....turning in the hip like a hinge...this works very well if you have not your left ellbow pressed to the rip....which a lot of photographer are doing.....this arm position creates two problems...first....you can't hold the lens proper static when you breath....sometimes you have to do this....and second, it disturb the turning of the upper body when you follow the racer....I have my left arm which is holding the lense horizontal.....straight out of the shoulder....so there is nothing which can disturb the turning.

And shoot when the vehicle isn't directly in front of you.  Sure enough

you can try to make the picture when the car is direct in front of you....SSS, you got a example at home.......but this will work out, only when you following the moving racer....to do this you have to catch him far before....and then try to keep the racer in the center of the viewfinder.... ....

Doug,

Hasselblad....fine equipment....be aware that a proper long lens for the distance shot would be 800+ mm....a dream....and yes....you can make so picture......but then you are not looking through the viewfinder....you will use a open viewframe which is fixed on the top of the camera....and the camera body is screwed on a holding device with two handles...
we done it in the past....
and by the way....in my hometown I still can get 6x6 roll film and also they will develop the slide and negative film....a 6x6 will be always a dream....

[McRat]

Sidebar - Probably way old news.

My wife got a camera a couple of years ago from Casio.

It does magic tricks.

If you are trying to capture a specific event that you don't know when it's going to happen, it will backtrack for you.

Let's say I want to get a picture of a baseball player swinging a bat at the moment the ball and bat touch.  Your RT is not quick enough to catch that.  And you will make VERY long movies waiting for a pitch.

Or something freaky happens, and I'm too late to hit the shutter.

You hit the button late, then you backtrack at 60 FPS until you find the shot with the event occurred.  This is done in picture mode.  It keeps a buffer of images internally in case you hit the shutter late.

It can also catch a bullet in flight.  It has a 1000fps mode.  Very low res, but if you fired a .45 automatic at a gallon water jug, it would catch the impact most the time and see the bullet.

Not good for commercial stuff, but great for racing action shots (I suppose those are rare at BVille, but common in other forms of racing)

[Freud]

The Nikons with the small sensor have the 1.5 factor.

The D700 and up are full frame:as in 35mm format.

A 600 mm lens is a 600 not a 900.

When you use a very long lens, because of the distance from the course, it's like shooting thru a drinking straw.

I shot with a 300mm f2.8 for 10 years because I was only 220 feet from the course and filled the frame.

If you have a fluid head tripod it is easy to get a sharp image in a shot that is at a right angle to the car.  It just

takes many years of dehydrating for 8 hours along side the course. Hard to believe? I can show you.

But, I never shot a 400 MPH vehicle either. The angular velocity is at a maximum at 90 degrees.

That's why people shoot before the vehicle gets to you.

FREUD

[fastman614]

Hmmmm.... I thought I could learn something here ..... What I see are words in English .... I know the meanings of the words.... but, when put together in sentences, they are describing things that seem to be beyond my ability to understand at this time....

Showing that good photography is something along the lines of an engineering specialty in and of itself....

I LUV you guys....

[Freud]

When I shot with film cameras there was no auto focus.  It was a matter of manual follow

focus.

The closer you are to the course the greater the angular velocity.

So with a long lens that moves you away from the course and maintains the

the same image size the angular velocity slows down and the pan is easier.

There just isn't much of a background with the long lens.

That's why i enjoyed the 300.

With todays rules for fotogs I have no interest in shooting the event.

Bless the fellows like Pork Pie, Ray Therat and Scooter. They are dedicated.

FREUD

[Captthundarr]

I swear I thought the subject title said pornography question - some sort of slip I guess