Head Bolts Or Studs

BasementBorn · March 25, 2015, 02:21:32 PM

I am looking for some suggestions for suppliers of head bolts or studs. The engine is a 04 Suzuki GSXR 600 and of course since it is a 600 and not a 1000 or Busa I can't seem to track anything down. I am running blown gas and possibly blown fuel and theoretically I am hoping to be in the 20-25psi range. At this point pretty much everything I can do to the motor has been done but I am worried about the head bolts being the weak link. APE Raceparts is one of my sponsors on it so we have checked through their stock and what they make to see if we could find anything that could work but no dice. They could custom make some but they can't make bolts for just one bike cost effectively and there just isn't the demand for them to produce a large batch. I haven't talked with ARP yet but I know they don't have anything specifically listed for a 600, I plan on sending them the dimensions I need and seeing if they can help. Just curious if anyone has any other suggestions. Worst case I will probably run new stock bolts and hope for the best but it's worth a shot.

rouse · March 25, 2015, 02:59:19 PM

ARP studs and nuts. No need to ware the cases out by removing and reinstalling bolts ever time you pull the engine down.

Rouse

BasementBorn · March 25, 2015, 03:13:02 PM

They are next on my list to contact. Just seeing if there is anywhere else I should check.

tauruck · March 25, 2015, 03:37:40 PM

ARP studs.

Milwaukee Midget · March 25, 2015, 03:48:54 PM

There may be some European companies making studs, (and don't even consider bolts for heads - Rouse is absolutely right) but ARP is the last word in fasteners - at least in the States.

Talk to APE - I used their valve springs from the KZ1000 drag kit on the Midget, they source quality parts, and they probably have sway with their suppliers. I'd bet they can be your mouthpiece with ARP to come up with a set that will work for you.

The only downside to studs on a bike is if you need to pull the head with the engine in the frame. You will have likely eliminated that option, which might make checking your engine in impound a real PITA..

BasementBorn · March 25, 2015, 04:19:10 PM

I definitely want to go studs assuming I can find them. I figured ARP would be the best bet for a place to try. May have to take a look overseas if they can't help me out.

APE has been great, they have done a ton of work on it so far. This is the only thing engine related I haven't been able to get either through or directly from them.

I don't have any problem dropping the engine out if need be. Hopefully it is in impound, sounds like a PITA I wouldn't mind having.

Thanks

manta22 · March 25, 2015, 05:38:16 PM

Quote from: Milwaukee Midget on March 25, 2015, 03:48:54 PM
There may be some European companies making studs, (and don't even consider bolts for heads - Rouse is absolutely right) but ARP is the last word in fasteners - at least in the States.

Talk to APE - I used their valve springs from the KZ1000 drag kit on the Midget, they source quality parts, and they probably have sway with their suppliers. I'd bet they can be your mouthpiece with ARP to come up with a set that will work for you.

The only downside to studs on a bike is if you need to pull the head with the engine in the frame. You will have likely eliminated that option, which might make checking your engine in impound a real PITA..

Chris;

I don't trust ARP. Some time ago I bought some nuts for my head studs and one nut had no threads. Not aerospace quality control, that's for sure, but light years ahead of Chinese fasteners.

Regards, Neil Tucson, AZ

Milwaukee Midget · March 25, 2015, 05:52:00 PM

Quote from: manta22 on March 25, 2015, 05:38:16 PM
Quote from: Milwaukee Midget on March 25, 2015, 03:48:54 PM
There may be some European companies making studs, (and don't even consider bolts for heads - Rouse is absolutely right) but ARP is the last word in fasteners - at least in the States.

Talk to APE - I used their valve springs from the KZ1000 drag kit on the Midget, they source quality parts, and they probably have sway with their suppliers. I'd bet they can be your mouthpiece with ARP to come up with a set that will work for you.

The only downside to studs on a bike is if you need to pull the head with the engine in the frame. You will have likely eliminated that option, which might make checking your engine in impound a real PITA..

Chris;

I don't trust ARP. Some time ago I bought some nuts for my head studs and one nut had no threads. Not aerospace quality control, that's for sure, but light years ahead of Chinese fasteners.

Regards, Neil Tucson, AZ

Interesting, in that I bought a set of "ARP" studs - the quotes indicating a swindle - one of which Mark was able to snap off as we approached the recommended torque setting.

Clearly not the real deal.

I'll only go through an authorized dealer from now on.

I'm assuming you did as well, and were able to get a replacement at no cost?

Of course, that's of no help if you're looking to race on Saturday, and the nut bag arrived on Friday.

Yeah, they're supposed to have threads . . .

fordboy628 · March 25, 2015, 06:04:03 PM

BB,

ARP may have something that will work, listed in their mfg database that they "private label" for someone. You would need to purchase it from that company.

Alternatively, ARP may have something that will work with "slight" modifications.

Before checking with Euro mfg's, be aware that Euro & Japanese metric thread forms are different.

Fordboy

BasementBorn · March 25, 2015, 06:39:51 PM

I'll have to do some more digging around with them and see if we can turn anything up. Hopefully I can find something that will work.

I do know that APE makes head studs for the same year 750 which is very similar to the 600 in most aspects. The problem with them is the length. Do any of you see any potential problems with either shortening them, assuming there are enough threads available, or adding a spacer between the head and the nut? Just speaking in general because I assume not many have experiences with this specific engine of course.

Speed Limit 1000 · March 25, 2015, 06:49:03 PM

A hard washer might help if the studs are not too much longer and they still fit under the cam cover

BasementBorn · March 25, 2015, 06:56:18 PM

Exactly what I was thinking. I'll have to look more in to that as well.

RansomT · March 26, 2015, 03:20:48 AM

Quote from: BasementBorn on March 25, 2015, 06:39:51 PM
I'll have to do some more digging around with them and see if we can turn anything up. Hopefully I can find something that will work.

I do know that APE makes head studs for the same year 750 which is very similar to the 600 in most aspects. The problem with them is the length. Do any of you see any potential problems with either shortening them, assuming there are enough threads available, or adding a spacer between the head and the nut? Just speaking in general because I assume not many have experiences with this specific engine of course.

Less than a 2mm difference, no?

BasementBorn · March 26, 2015, 07:57:48 AM

I don't know the exact difference, I think it's pretty minimal.

fordboy628 · March 26, 2015, 08:14:56 AM

Quote from: BasementBorn on March 25, 2015, 06:39:51 PM
The problem with them is the length. Do any of you see any potential problems with either shortening them, assuming there are enough threads available, or adding a spacer between the head and the nut? Just speaking in general because I assume not many have experiences with this specific engine of course.

No problem with shortening, I've done it many times. Carbide cutter on the lathe, mount stud in a 5C collet for ease of mounting and no damage. I prefer to shorten the block end if possible.

Be VERY careful if grinding them shorter. Don't impact the heat treatment.

Is it possible to "deepen" the threads in the block? I've done this a few times, and I like it better as it "buries" the stress in the block "deeper". This may not be possible with thinwall motorcycle castings though.

Fordboy

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Head Bolts Or Studs