Belly Tank Build Diary

[Mike Brown]

  Mike please describe the torque steer

Tom.  that is what this website has also brought to the sport  I sure hope Jon finds some one who will be able to keep this website going to:
To honor what John Amo started and Slim has so greatly continued   Protect your Legacies  Jon   find someone!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Sparky, I second the thought that this site is a great asset to those who want to go fast safely.  I have learned great things on this build diary. 

The torque steer that I experienced was that while the tires remained on the ground, I believe that the entire chassis rotated (I don't know if it actually twisted much) and it was like the car was banking of sorts heading to one side under torque then coming back as torque decreased.  The car was hunting not wanting to go straight almost the entire mile.  It was miserable.  That was with the shocks set at 3 compression and 3 rebound as recommended.  I kept increasing the compression and rebound until I was at 15 out of the maximum of 18.  The car then drove much better but not as good as with the rubber springs.  I felt that that replacing spring rate with dampening was not a good solution.  I found some issues with the rubber spring perches, fixed that and I have since stayed with the rubber springs. 

[SPARKY]

sounds almost exactly what I had a first

how much scrub radius do you have?  sight down your king pin where it strikes  vs the center of the front tire footprint measure

[Mike Brown]

sounds almost exactly what I had a first

how much scrub radius do you have?  sight down your king pin where it strikes  vs the center of the front tire footprint measure

Sparky,

To race at the Texas Mile we had to have DOT approved tires or race tires, no drag radials front or rear.  I ended up purchasing Michelin Pilot Sport tires with a "Y" rating.  Unfortunately, the narrowest and tallest tires that would work required 18" rims.  The original rims were 15".  I purchased 18" steel rims with the correct bolt pattern however the backspacing was way off.  I had James at Weldcraft Wheels correct the backspacing.  He did an amazing job.  In that process I corrected the scrub radius to nearly zero and it has been that way for a long time.  The car drives straight at this point with no issues other than traction on the big end which I hope to improve upon with this wing project. 

[JAL AKA JL222]

I went online with Jegs where I purchased the tires and started a "chat".  I asked the same questions and attached photos.  They told me that they would replace the tires.  I drove (1-1/2 hours) to Jegs this morning.  The counter person told me that Mickey Thompson tires had no warranty.  I explained the chat and promise of new tires.  They not only replaced the tires but they mounted and balanced the tires in their tire shop.  They didn't charge me for anything.  It was refreshing to have someone stand by their promise and gives me caution when purchasing to insure the manufacture covers obvious manufacturing defects.

  How about Goodyear Land Racing Tires 2944 28 X 10?  Thia is a Stock Car Talladega type tire. They make a lot of them so the cost is less.  $330

  No thread, Slick for more rubber on the ground and more traction.

  Look up stock car racing tire pressures. 20 to 50lbs [on right front because of more load]


                 JL222 

[JAL AKA JL222]

  Mike

  How much pressure in your tires?

  what is your spring pressure is it to high?

  Can you move the later bars up to get a higher instant center and more weight transfer.

  I guess you mounted the engine where it is to fit in, but if you could move it back it would help with your traction problems. Just some would help.

  And the Talladegas

                        JL222

[Mike Brown]

I went online with Jegs where I purchased the tires and started a "chat".  I asked the same questions and attached photos.  They told me that they would replace the tires.  I drove (1-1/2 hours) to Jegs this morning.  The counter person told me that Mickey Thompson tires had no warranty.  I explained the chat and promise of new tires.  They not only replaced the tires but they mounted and balanced the tires in their tire shop.  They didn't charge me for anything.  It was refreshing to have someone stand by their promise and gives me caution when purchasing to insure the manufacture covers obvious manufacturing defects.

  How about Goodyear Land Racing Tires 2944 28 X 10?  Thia is a Stock Car Talladega type tire. They make a lot of them so the cost is less.  $330

  No thread, Slick for more rubber on the ground and more traction.

  Look up stock car racing tire pressures. 20 to 50lbs [on right front because of more load]


                 JL222

Here is a section of the rule book from the Texas Mile,

5.1.1  Tires of any construction for use in land speed competition on nonpaved
surfaces, tires designated for use in drag racing and biased ply tires designed for
highway or off-road use, are strictly forbidden.

Land speed tires are strictly forbidden and I have been told that they are too hard for the paved surfaces that I run on. 

[JAL AKA JL222]

I went online with Jegs where I purchased the tires and started a "chat".  I asked the same questions and attached photos.  They told me that they would replace the tires.  I drove (1-1/2 hours) to Jegs this morning.  The counter person told me that Mickey Thompson tires had no warranty.  I explained the chat and promise of new tires.  They not only replaced the tires but they mounted and balanced the tires in their tire shop.  They didn't charge me for anything.  It was refreshing to have someone stand by their promise and gives me caution when purchasing to insure the manufacture covers obvious manufacturing defects.

  How about Goodyear Land Racing Tires 2944 28 X 10?  Thia is a Stock Car Talladega type tire. They make a lot of them so the cost is less.  $330

  No thread, Slick for more rubber on the ground and more traction.

  Look up stock car racing tire pressures. 20 to 50lbs [on right front because of more load]


                 JL222

Here is a section of the rule book from the Texas Mile,

5.1.1  Tires of any construction for use in land speed competition on nonpaved
surfaces, tires designated for use in drag racing and biased ply tires designed for
highway or off-road use, are strictly forbidden.

Land speed tires are strictly forbidden and I have been told that they are too hard for the paved surfaces that I run on.

  Well, their completely ignorant of the 2944 as it is used in every CUP car. Especially at Daytona and Talladega.

  Ask if a Talladega stock car tire is OK. Better yet buy them and if asked tell them it's a stock car tire.

  This is not a tire built by Goodyear for land speed racing but a tire already in use by stock cars and rated for 300 mph.

                             JL222


                     

[37 ROADSTER]

Cup cars run 18in wheels these are no longer used in Nascar.

[JAL AKA JL222]

Cup cars run 18in wheels these are no longer used in Nascar.

Forgot about that change. But they did for many years.

  Still making then though are other stock cars using them?

   As far as being too hard, the 222 Camaro left some impressive black marks taking off at Bville.

                       JL222

[JAL AKA JL222]

  Upon further review   When Texas mile refers to Bonneville tires being too hard I was thinking tire compound
but they are probably referring to the high recommended 70lbs of pressure which makes them hard.
And worried about tire spin and loss of control.

                        JL222

[Mike Brown]

I ran Hoosier spec circuit racing rear tires at the Texas mile for a top speed of 203.4 mph with no handling problems.  The track was just too short (8,000 feet) for my liking.  I could safely shutdown but there was no extra length in the event of a problem.  We took our 2 club shirt and went back on the trailer.  Good people, well ran event. 

[Mike Brown]

A photo of the finished wing.  The wing "struts" if you will are bicycle spokes.  They are high tensile and have an aerodynamic profile (almost flat) to reduce drag in high performance bicycling applications.  The top is held in place with a "button" that is curved to allow good bearing inside the wing.  The bottom is attached by mounts that I machined.  The connection on the bottom is via a threaded "spoke nipple" (don't go there Stainless).  This allows the struts to be pretensioned.  I fabricated smaller end plates that will reduce drag and downforce slightly.  The integral Gurney flap on the extrusion was machined off.  I can bolt on larger end plates and add various Gurney flaps if required. 

[bubruins]

Blade style bicycle spoke is genius. Looks great!

[Mike Brown]

I exhibited the belly tank at the Cincinnati Cavalcade of Customs.  Not being a traditional show car, I chose to be in "Survivor's Alley".  This was a very interesting banger across the aisle.  It is a club car that they race at the TROG event currently held in Wilwood New Jersey.  Tech doesn't seem to be very technical, but I guess the speeds they reach on the beach aren't that great.   

[Stainless1]

Way more safety equipment than old time Bonneville and dry lakes cars....