Bonneville on TV

[landsendlynda]

What is really sad is that the guy in charge of filming the National Geographic film was the same one in charge of the Discovery Channel film.... he knew what he was doing, so it has to be the editors and producers.  Obviously, they didn't listen to Landspeed Louise or it would have been better!

Lynda

[KIRIAKAI]

Let me start by pointing out that I am writing this so as to not use all CAPS, which was my first admonishment shortly after posting my first comment on the forum.... As the general manager of Cliff Gullett's dealership in Bozeman, I had the opportunity to watch Cliff's passion increase with his salt fever.
Cliff was interviewed by the production company that Dan Caesar owns and he (cliff)told me that they were opting for Leslie, and then added that he was sure there might be something to do with her looks versus his...... always a quip from Cliff, as you who knew him would know.
Anyway, we watched the program and saw several shots of the #7070 liner, and were pleased to see the liner on the salt. On the last day of speed week, Cliff called me and told me that he was going to be late getting back as he was staying to be sure that Jason was OK after his accident. Kind of ironic, but he was a true patron of Land Speed Racing.
He and Jack Costella were constantly talking, drawing, working on the next thing that would add speed to the liner. But both were always committed to having the liner as safe as possible, and if it didn't feel right, Cliff didn't run.
I have produced commercial and infomercials, training videos, etc, in my past, and there is a term in advertising called "puffery" which is applied exaggeration of a situation for the sake of drawing attention to a situation.
Dan Caesar's production company took literally hundreds of hours of film, and there was some license taken in running footage in reverse to have a car " go the other way" on film.
I have spoken to Dan since Cliff's death at BUB and from my conversation I can tell you he has salt fever, and he may even come to race, although I do not know in what.....
I was certainly affected to hear that there were fatalities at Bonneville, and knew that one was Cliff, I was affected to hear "rider down, rider down", but here is what I do know....
It is fair to say the Land Speed Racing is not a "Spectator Sport", not when the courses are three and five miles, and not when safety precludes access to the courses from over a reasonable distance, whether by spectators or photographers or videographers.
I have read comments from Newbies, and from Old Timers in Land Speed Racing (reference made without relationship to the age of anyone) and the varying views and opinions are the very thing that make the challenge constant and the goal everpresent..... Everyone has an opinion, and while some liked and some disliked the show, there are some simple facts that cannot be ignored. First, it highlighted Land Speed Racing, which, again, depending on what your views and opinions are, is good or bad. Second, it is always easy to find fault, as it is kind of like hindsight - 20/20 after the fact.
Those who are active in Land Speed Racing know that the LSR community, which is for the most part, made up of common people who have an uncommon goal. Someone defined that as "greatness", and most in the community are caring people who want to set their own records, but will do anything they can to help others acheive their goals.
Cliff was that kind of guy! I printed off hundreds of comments, and several pointed out what Land Speed Racing was all about. One was from a father, who stated that he and his six year old son had come out to the salt to see if they could see any runs, and they were approached by Cliff, in his race suit, and struck up a conversation with them after making a run. He stated that he could not believe that Cliff would take the time to do that, and that he and his son would remember it always. Response from the LSR community indicated that Cliff was a well liked and respected member. Yet I am sure there were those among you who may not have had those feelings..... and that's O.K., because it is the diversity that makes it interesting.
A forum is a place to voice your opinion, and obviusly that had happened in this instance.
It has been said that to know someone, you must first walk a mile in their shoes.
Dan Caesar is someone I am confident has Salt Fever, and someone who has allowed his vocation to do something to bring Land Speed Racing to the masses, and for whom the possibiliy of standing on the salt at 100 degrees, for days, working under a canopy at the same temperature, with or without wind, with or without water, and do it all for the chance to run for a matter of seconds to see if you, and your machine, have what it takes to become a record holder. And then have to back it up!!!
Cliff set four records at Speed Week, and was only the second human over 200 MPH with less than a 350cc motor, and he was in great company when he got there. Leslie ran a 203 on a 1300cc Hyabusa.... Just a bit more irony, yet it doesn't take away from the acheivements of either of these two competitors.
No one program, no one person, no one accident, no one fatality will cause the end of Land Speed Racing, because all of you who race, will always try to better the next record. That is the nature of MAN.
I thank Dan for his contribution to Land Speed Racing, and hope that each of you will take from the program the "essence" of racing, which is the overview... the risk--------the effort....... and sometimes........ the reward.

Curt Lance
General Manager
Team Bozeman Motorsports

[narider]

Hey Deb, when you put it on utube I think it probably becomes public domain

No way.

That clip was stolen !

Ray Crowell owned the rights - he took the video.

That I know of, Ray Crowell was neither contacted or compensated
for the value of his "intellectual" property.

Todd and Deb didn't own the clip. 

Todd, when he posted the clip, said so.

Jason was the "actor" in the clip,  and he gave no permission.

I owned the bike in the clip, and I gave no permission.

Whose rights were violated here?

Good questions... and although I know jacksheet about the law of such things, I do know where my intentions in posting it were and are - which included no manner of monetary gain (I wonder if others can say the same?).

This video was turned over to the team in impound for SGR and SCTA viewing to help determine cause and possibly gain knoweldge and reasoning for any future additional safety measures if needed. Deb, myself and a quite a few others spent many hours and a little money that night getting the media into a viewable format, and it was done by including 2 other camera crews that I made sure verbally acknowledged that they (as commercial film crews) were not allowed the use of this video in anyway. I also did the best I could to make sure they didn't leave with copies of it as well (hard to do when it has to run through another person's machine to change the format of course - which is why we did the very loud, obvious and verbal agreeance in front of everyone).

I specifically stated in the posting of the video that I didn't own it or know the owner of it other then Jason asking me to post it. If asked I would of course take it down, but have not been asked to and have of course not profited or tried to profit from it in anyway.... as apparently others (as discussed here regarding this particular film) have.

I was also just made aware of another tv show that got video posted on the internet actually giving me credit for the video... I have never been contacted for use of it or given permission to anyone (nor do I have the ability to to do so). Quite the oppositte actually, as you can tell by my posted words that went up with the video when it got posted.

I have a lot of onbaord videos from the last 4 years or so both drag racing and lsr (maxton & bonneville), and was contacted by the people that film for the history channel to supply quite a few of them and in doing so they needed a release, and I also did the same with Jon's videos at WOS as well.
I can't imagine just taking video (or pictures) from somewhere without permission and trying to profit from them as was done with this video (legal or otherwise).

I was only slightly disappointed in the video... but the manner of gaining info without securing proper credits and/or facts concerning their info is bs at best imo.
Todd

PS: although not real intersting to me personally (I couldn't read all of this thread of course), there seems to be a lot of good conversation in here (hard to believe it's gone 10+ pages already - wow), I hope something is learned by it for future filming of lsr events.

[SPARKY]

SO many who grew up with the internet  are SO used to copying ANYTHING that they are intrested in with TOTAL disreguard to copyrights and artist rights that this PIRIACY does not suprise me----

Until they are sued and have to PAY or lose a JOB  they dont even begin to think it is WRONG WRONG WRONG---copyrite law was covered in DETAIL in my Soph. high school English class.---LONG, long before you tube or internet I might add---lol

[racergeo]

     Sparky, I have to correct you. It was LONG-LONG-LONG before Youtube or internet!

                                    xxxxxx Geo.

[SPARKY]

TOUCHE!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Buickguy3]

Kurt,
You have put what should be a cap on this thread. Doug Grieve, the SaltCat team. GodSpeed,Cliff

[Bob Drury]

  The next time someone wants to shoot a video about the salt have them contact me.  I will be glad to provide them with copies of a couple of Speed Vision shows from about ten years ago.
  Well written, produced, excellent camera work (not hand held for the most part) good interviews (allright, so I was in one), and very good comentary by Dave MacClellan who was the last good NHRA commentator (along with Steve Evans).
  There is absolutely no excuse for lack of accuracy on a taped program . 
  Along the same lines, I and several others were interviewed for a LSR article in Smithsonian Magazine (August 2005), and before printing the author called me to verify my statements.  That, folks, is how the real journalists do a story...no sensationalism neccessary................Bob

[Roadsters.com]

After seeing the broadcast, I was disappointed and then forgot about it until revisiting this thread. I find myself in agreement with the comments made by Bob Drury, Bret Kepner, and Dan Warner.

The production was superficial, inaccurate, and sensationalized. (How many times did they say "Diva from Texas" - was it three or four?)

An exceptional LSR documentary is "World's Fastest Motorcycle". DVDs of it are available from the AMA.

Dave
http://www.roadsters.com/

[gofast]

...  WFI was not accurate, it was still enjoyable, I watch it at least once a month, just for the salt scenes... 

.and I thought I was bad...once a month!!!!!!... ...you've got it bad Stainless.

Next time you watch WFI, take a hit of egg nog every time Burt says "What?" .

[LVMAXX]

 

[Roadsters.com]

Why couldn't the and the SCTA/BNI/USFRA/ECTA/The Texas Mile Organizations get together, and market their own video series?

It's not likely to happen because they are volunteer-driven organizations that are already overworked. A large increase in spectators would make them even more overworked.

With his video camera, Mark Brazeau does a fine job of documenting as much as he can.

Dave
http://www.roadsters.com/

[dwarner]

He cannot tell a story. He needs a class on editing.

DW

[Stainless1]

...  WFI was not accurate, it was still enjoyable, I watch it at least once a month, just for the salt scenes... 

.and I thought I was bad...once a month!!!!!!... ...you've got it bad Stainless.

Next time you watch WFI, take a hit of egg nog every time Burt says "What?" .

Egg Nog    I was thinking it would be more sporting with tequila, might miss the running scenes though  ... 

[gofast]

Well...there is a little rum in the eggnog